Racing Sails

Racing Sails

Postby drewlamparello » Thu Jan 28, 2016 8:36 am

Any of you folks have any experience with the high tech racing sails. If so what material do you have recommendations for etc? Does it help point the boat better? Any experience with Precision Sail loft from Canada? Any other lofts you'd recommend...
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Re: Racing Sails

Postby shnool » Fri Jan 29, 2016 5:52 pm

I've heard nightmare stories about Precision sails. I've had NO experience with them at all personally.

I went with D4 loadpath sails when I did my Capri 25. The difference between them and my 30 yo dacron sails, was night and day (and I considered my one dacron sail to be in good shape and not stretched, and my dacron (heavy) 155 was pretty good.. and it made a drastic difference in point, 2 to 3 degrees at least... but what really caught me off guard the most was how well they depowered, and how well they translated power (forward) from puffs, as opposed to heel.

Options are all over the place, but if you plan to race, I'd say Dimension Loadpath, Kevlar, Twaron, or Carbon... depending on your ability to pay really. Each has its advantages... Expect to pay $1500-$2500 for each sail depending on the sail.. lighter material spinnakers (generally nylon) will be around $1000

Some vendors with good reps:
Quantum
North
Doyle Boston
Elliot Pattison sails (my personal favorite, as Harry himself walked me through options and was super helpful to me when I called him. He also sold me 3 sails in 2 years, so I suspect he liked the repeat business).. I'm thinking of buying some sails from him in a few weeks too for my S2 7.9. He took easily an hour out of his day to explain my options and to figure out how I sail, and in what venue, and for sure I wasn't a big customer for him.

Some decent tier 2 vendors
FX
Mauri Pro
pineapple sails

Original:
Image

New Loadpath D4s from epsails.com (they are a top vendor for Capri 25 Nationals qualifying boats).
Image
- former owner 1989 Capri 22 hull number 513, standard rig wing keel Mark I race package -
Then I upgraded to a 1982 Capri 25 fin keel (fun boat!)
Former 1982 S2 7.9 weighted daggerboard, with outboard (also a fun boat),
NOW 1983 WD Schock Wavelength 24
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Re: Racing Sails

Postby pgudat » Sun Jan 31, 2016 8:45 pm

drewlamparello wrote:Any of you folks have any experience with the high tech racing sails. If so what material do you have recommendations for etc? Does it help point the boat better? Any experience with Precision Sail loft from Canada? Any other lofts you'd recommend...


Ullman San Diego makes the best Capri22 sails in my opinion.
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Re: Racing Sails

Postby drewlamparello » Wed Feb 03, 2016 10:38 am

Appreciate the insights. North (North Lam) and Ulman are with $10 of each other for the price of a 155 and Main... Sounds like the same material from the descriptions. The North Guy is here and will measure and walk me through the options. Chuck from Ulman is effectively, we make the best and I'll tell you what you need... So need to think on this a bit more but definitely think it will get me a faster boat so read to go for it...

As to Price UK is actually 30% cheaper for what effectively seems the same sail... But last time I went there 3 years ago for the current main, he actually decided with out input from me to make the main 1 foot less in the roach to reduce heeling...That doesn't sit well For this he promises the roach will just touch the back stay since this will be considered a racing sail... Thanks for any and all thoughts and helping me sort all of this out
Drew
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Re: Racing Sails

Postby pgudat » Wed May 31, 2017 9:36 am

pgudat wrote:Ullman San Diego makes the best Capri22 sails in my opinion.


While Ullman did make good sails, their customer service in the San Diego Loft is atrocious. We ordered sails in September for December delivery and still haven't gotten them. I'd steer clear of them now.
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Re: Racing Sails

Postby delling3 » Thu Jun 01, 2017 9:18 am

Sailmakers here in the Midwest change their affiliations like most people change their underwear.

The U.K. loft is now North Sails.

The Quantum and (previous) North Sails loft have merged and are now Ullman

Quantum now has a sales rep, but no loft locally in Detroit.

I just had a new racing mainsail built by Ullman. It is manufactured of Marblehead Dacron, and based on a few sails, it is fast. I need a new #1 (probably will have to wait until next season). Same sailmaker is recommending a "Flex" construction - basically a mylar/polyester product designed for cross-cut construction instead of tri-radial. Much less $$ than a string sail, and more durable. I had similar sails on my prior boat (Pearson Flyer) and they were fast, and kept their shape very well.
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Re: Racing Sails

Postby pgudat » Fri Jun 02, 2017 9:52 am

I am in the Midwest and sailmaking is still a person to person contact game, not a amazon style purchase. The money in sails is what is driving all the change. There just isn't much $$ anymore.

What loft should we use? If we all used the same Midwest loft, then we could progressively refine the sails. If everyone buys from different lofts, then the iterations are so far apart, there isn't much growth in the shape and performance. the SD loft used to have their sailmakers sail Capri's so there was a lot of immediate design influence that is hopefully still present today.
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Re: Racing Sails

Postby delling3 » Fri Jun 02, 2017 7:51 pm

From my perspective, you have three options - one of the "big guys" (North, Quantum, Ullman, etc.), one of the tier II guys (Sobstad, Harstick, etc) or the "online" shops.

The big guys typically don't build the sail anymore. They are built at a factory, and shipped to the loft for delivery, and depending on the sail, maybe some finish work. These guys have the ability to make all the sexy stuff, but you pay for it. The tier II guys are usually still making their own sails. They can't offer load path sails, and are typically still building a tri-radial or crosscut sail. To me, these guys represent great value. Then the online guys. I have bought a sail that way, and I was pretty happy with the transaction. And you will save money. But probably not the best bet for racing sails. You didn't mention where specifically you are. Sobstad MW in Rocky River, OH has given me some very attractive quotes, and is building a spinnaker for the boat that I am racing the Mackinac race on this year. His price quotes are very competitive with the online guys, and I am very tempted to buy a #1 from them. Guy's name is Rich Wilber.
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Re: Racing Sails

Postby odj22sailor » Thu Jun 15, 2017 7:35 pm

Does anyone need sails I can get a carbon load path Main for around 2,000 for a Capri 22.
One for top button all the bells and whistles.
Capri 22
Tall Rig Fin Keel
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